It sure took long enough to happen, but one of HD DVD's
biggest benefits has finally made it over to the Blu-ray side. Yep, we're talking about a Blu-ray / DVD hybrid disc, with a single-layer of Blu on one side and a standard DVD on the very same side (as in, not a "flipper" disc). Not surprisingly, the action's going down first in Japan, with
Code Blue emergency helicopter doctor Blu-ray BOX (yes, seriously) as the first hybrid title. There's no word on when (or if) this technology will make it to US soil, but the sooner the better -- nothing like a little inbuilt backwards compatibility to ease the mind.
[Via
CDRInfo]
Reader Comments (Page 1 of 2)
rscottyl @ Dec 20th 2008 12:10PM
Nooooooo! I hate "flipper" discs!
I would rather have the two seperate discs than one flipper disc.
J.Goodwin @ Dec 20th 2008 7:41PM
This isn't a flipper disc. You're not paying attention.
The Blu layer is closest to the surface, and two DVD layers are deep in the disc. The Blu layer is "transparent" to the DVD wavelength laser, which passes right through and sees the DVD layers. The Blu laser reads the Blu layer only, and doesn't even know that the DVD layers exist.
WebDev511 @ Dec 21st 2008 5:44PM
Correct, it is not like the HD DVD/DVD combo disc which was a flipper that had two DVD layers on one side and two HD DVD layers on the other.
This hybrid looks like you get two layers of SD and one layer of HD and that's it. It would have been more useful to have this when Blu-Ray launched and would be surprised if we see very many titles released on these discs.
Fargus @ Dec 19th 2008 10:51PM
Why have the engineers been wasting their time on this crap? All we need is another excuse to charge more for a blu-ray.
El perron @ Dec 20th 2008 2:49AM
Whaaaa? theres still HDDVD fanboys after HDDVD has been burned to death? If you dont like it dont buy it, no one is holding you a gun to your head to buy blu-ray movies.
dj496 @ Dec 20th 2008 7:19AM
@El perron: did he say he didn't like blu-ray?
squiggleslash @ Dec 20th 2008 2:18PM
How is it wasting time? The incompatibility of Blu-ray discs with the existing DVD infrastructure is one thing that's holding Blu-ray back. How many families with such a thing do you think want to spend $30 on a "family entertainment" disc like a Pixar movie if they can't play it on the minivan's entertainment system, or the kid's bedrooms DVD player?
YOU may not find it useful. That doesn't mean others don't consider it important. Making Blu-ray work everywhere is one of the critical aspects to adoption. Otherwise it's a minor upgrade that costs too much and requires too much investment in new equipment.
SoCoolCurt (PSN: KillaKornbread - XBL: SoCoolCurt) @ Jan 4th 2009 12:40AM
that's one of the reasons i still mainly stick to DVD right now. the only Blu-Ray player i have is my PS3, and even though i have all the equipment to enjoy Hi-Def Movies (Hi-Def TV and PS3 connected via HDMI) i still dont want to buy them since i can only play them in one place. i also like to rip my DVD's to my PC hard drive so i can watch movies without having to switch DVD's all the time. i can't rip Blu-Rays right now either so that's also a negative.
if this becomes a standard feature in future Blu-Rays (or Blu-Ray players and movies get cheap enough) then i can certainly see myself buying more Blu-Ray movies. i wouldnt mind watching ripped DVD's when im just by myself and a Hi-Def version when im with people. but if not, then i don't mind ripped and upscaled DVD's.
Rich @ Dec 19th 2008 10:54PM
I thought that they made a way to put them both versions on the same side, which is why there was concern with compatibility. I read this on bluray.com
J.Goodwin @ Dec 19th 2008 11:10PM
Correct. Apparently the blu layer is composed of some sort of film that reflects the wavelength of a blu-ray laser, while permitting most of the dvd wavelength laser to pass through.
DVD4ME @ Dec 19th 2008 11:12PM
If the BDA is in control it will have to be profile 53 with every current player obsolete!
MrGuru @ Jan 1st 2009 3:44AM
Actually all blu-ray players have an option to read hybrid Blu-dvd's
hey hey @ Dec 19th 2008 11:25PM
I was on the side of HD-DVD during the format war, and the DVD combo disc was horrible! Digital Copy + a BD with lossless audio is fine with me.
EatingPie @ Dec 20th 2008 11:50AM
Indeed! Sort of a gaffe for EngadgetHD to leave this out.
The HD-DVD/DVD combo disc cost more -- a LOT MORE -- than it's standard HD-DVD counterpart. The HD-DVD/DVD combo was also prone to failure.
Lots of supporters bailed completely when the HD-DVD was announced as a Combo, waiting a few months for the studio to finally release an HD-DVD-only version.
Now, it's a good idea IN THEORY. It could have won the format war if implementation and pricing had been doable. Alas it wasn't. And I honestly doubt blu-ray will go down this path.
A better solution: Disney's Sleeping Beauty. A Blu-ray that INCLUDED A SEPARATE DVD. If every title did this, and studios marketed it, Blu-ray would take off like a rocket!
-Pie
chumley @ Dec 20th 2008 7:26PM
> A better solution: Disney's Sleeping Beauty. A Blu-ray that INCLUDED A SEPARATE DVD.
> If every title did this, and studios marketed it, Blu-ray would take off like a rocket!
I would love that, but I doubt that most studios will go there. A single disk is necessary to constrain usage. People could buy the package, keep the disk they want, and resell the other. Or, god forbid, the could watch both disks simultaneously.
wreckedchevy @ Dec 19th 2008 11:28PM
well one step closer to catching up to hd-dvd now if they would just lose the java i would jump in the blu bus....
skcusynos @ Dec 20th 2008 1:40AM
Blu bus?! It's more like a blu Pinto with a flat and a shot gearbox!
chumley @ Dec 19th 2008 11:46PM
Wow, I thought this couldn't be done due to technical issues and/or contention between DVDF and BDA. It could help speed adoption of BD, but if it's limited to a single BD layer that is not good.
NewGalactic @ Dec 20th 2008 1:15PM
Yeah, one-layer DVD doesn't sound like it'll cut it. Personally, I think a combo BD/DVD ends up being an expensive product that doesn't deliver on the full potential of either side. It ends up having to do two jobs; and poorly. Stick with one or the other.
farkblu @ Dec 20th 2008 1:03AM
Congratulations Fony, after 3 years you have finally reached the point the the apparently inferior tech HD DVD was and hasn't it been worth the wait...............NOT!
skcusynos @ Dec 20th 2008 1:19AM
With sony in control, if this thing ever becomes the new main stream standard the worlds ugliest and most arrogant CE producer will be out of control with it's greed and manipulation of consumers, god help us all if that happens, it will be bend over and touch your toes here comes sony again and again.
Fuck blu ray, I hope it dies!!
shamon @ Dec 20th 2008 1:37AM
whats the meaning of having this ?
WebDev511 @ Dec 20th 2008 1:44AM
The red laser layer will never be certified by the DVD Forum, so if they release it, what will they call it?
I agree that this is bad news for those of us that want high quality picture AND sound. If this takes off we'll actually be worse off than if we'd had combo discs. At least those had an additional 5GB (and potentially 22GB if 51GB triple layers ever made it out of the lab.) on the HD side of the disc.
On the bright side, a certain company that used to make HD DVD players will be releasing iPod/Zune sized (1.8") 256GB SSD in Q2 of next year. Enough room for 5 full BD in your pocket.
3dpenguin @ Dec 20th 2008 2:55AM
Actually DVD Forum has done several things which would have went a long way with helping the potential of HD DVD since the demise of the format. They approved a 16GB dual sided disc, and just before the format went under they had approved further development of the single sided HD DVD/DVD combo disc, you know what Blu-ray is now crowing about doing, this format was actually enacted on all Toshiba HD DVD players before they pulled the plug.
As for the Zune with the extra storage, the great thing about Digital Downloads are you can find a place to store them for several years and then go back to watch them again without fear of Disc-rot, or just delete the movie if you are completely done with it, good luck on getting the same options with Blu-ray.
DrXym @ Dec 20th 2008 6:11AM
JVC announce a hybrid disc BD/DVD in 2004. This may be the commercialized version of that, not that I see much point in hybrids except perhaps for some edge cases. It certainly shouldn't matter if the DVD Forum bless the forum or not. At worst it probably means that hybrid discs can't show the DVD-Video logo.
WebDev511 @ Dec 20th 2008 4:37PM
Of course they can't use the DVD logo if it isn't approved, but can they even print "Plays in both Blu-Ray and DVD Players." ? I know it's silly, but lawyers are going to want their cut.
DrXym @ Dec 22nd 2008 8:41AM
Yeah, they'd probably have to say something along those lines. Personally I would hope the DVD Forum would approve hybrids assuming the spec was solid.
img eL @ Dec 20th 2008 2:36AM
Technology that you would not believe
800lb Droll @ Dec 20th 2008 3:15AM
lmao! so many disgruntled HD-DVD twits burning in their own rage!
DrXym @ Dec 20th 2008 6:09AM
Just wait for the implosions that will happen in January & February when the 1st anniversary of HD DVD's demise comes around. I wonder if Toshiba will use CES 2009 to announce a Blu Ray player.
DVD4ME @ Dec 20th 2008 8:24AM
xym, your brave spouting off your usual sh*t after your proclamations in October, you said, and I quote, ......................................"so the true figure of active blu ray players is probably between 3 and 5 million. I expect with Christmas approaching and much better prices on players that the number of standalones is likely to double by January."
Not sure who's ass you pulled that one out of, but do you really think between 3 & 5 million stand alone players have sold in the 2 months since you spouted that BS or are more units going to be sold in the next 3 weeks then have been sold in the last 3 years????
If anyone is going to implode it should be you after that ridiculous statement!
How do you like your crow, toasted, fried or on the wing???
DrXym @ Dec 20th 2008 10:33AM
Sorry dumbass I never said Blu Ray would sell between 3 and 5 million players in 2 months, so stop lying by saying I did.
DVD4ME @ Dec 20th 2008 5:33PM
xym, that is your quote, that is a direct cut and paste from what you said, so who's the dumbass.
DrXym @ Dec 20th 2008 7:14PM
No dumbass, you deliberately took my words out of context in a story referring to results up to 3Q 2008. Here they are in full:
"1.7% equates to about 2 million homes. With PS3 included its 8 million homes. Obviously many PS3 owners may not use them for Blu Ray movies so the true figure of active players is probably between 3 and 5 million. I expect with Christmas approaching and much better prices on players that the number of standalones is likely to double by January."
And here is the story in the which the comment was made.
http://www.engadgethd.com/2008/10/15/blu-ray-player-prices-dropped-12-in-q3-still-in-just-1-7-of-u/
I very specifically said standalones, not PS3s were 2 million up to 3Q and it was likely, LIKELY that sales of standalones, STANDALONES would double by January. i.e. in the last quarter of 2008 that ownership would double from 2 million to 4 million.. Considering annual sales of DVD players are typically 50-60% in the last quarter alone what I said was not especially controversial.
As you previously called me out at the time on the 2 million I can only assume you have some kind of impairment to now claim I actually said 3-5 million. And as I said at the time, if in the event it transpires only 1.5 million players or whatever were sold you can parade around like you are some miniature caesar crowing over your little victory.
Grow up.
DVD4ME @ Dec 20th 2008 11:13PM
I scaled your ridiculous claim down from 3-5 too 2 million, either way your the dumbass, your sony sucking hasn't paid off, blu ray is not going main stream this holiday season as you have been claiming for months, if you don't want to get called out on all the BS you spray, Shut the FK up, and in your words, grow up dumbass.
DrXym @ Dec 21st 2008 4:22AM
Okay, I get it. You can't even acknowledge what I said even when I explain it to you. Grow up idiot.
Gus @ Dec 21st 2008 6:10PM
Dr.Xym=*pwned*
DrXym @ Dec 22nd 2008 8:36AM
That would be "pwned" in the "two morons who by deliberate design or stupidity distort what I said and then mod their posts up to make themselves seem superior" sense. Grow up.
DVD4ME @ Dec 22nd 2008 8:19PM
LOL, hook line and sinker every time, your such a predictable little fangirl.
Mojo_Yugen @ Dec 20th 2008 1:01PM
I think you are all missing the real news here. "Code Blue emergency helicopter doctor" is finally coming to Blu-ray! I mean come on! It's about a doctor...in a feakin' HEICOPTER...dealing with, not a code yellow, not a code red...but a CODE BLUE EMERGENCY! I may have to learn Japanese just to fully enjoy this show.
Mojo_Yugen @ Dec 20th 2008 1:04PM
On second thought maybe he's just a mechanic that repairs helicopters. That wouldn't be as cool.
Michael @ Dec 20th 2008 1:55PM
I disagree with most of the posters here, I think this is a great idea. I HATED the combo-discs on HD DVD because I really enjoy having a disc image, but if a Blu-ray disc can play in high def on a Blu-ray player, and standard def on a DVD player, without making it a double sided disc... I'm all for that!
Reason 1) I can take my Blu-rays to my friends places and still watch the movies.
Reason 2) I can loan my Blu-rays to friends without Blu-ray players.
Reason 3) I can watch my Blu-rays on my computer or in other rooms without Blu-ray players.
Reason 4) Fans of a movie that do not yet have Blu-ray, but intend to upgrade at some point, can buy only one copy of the movie.
WebDev511 @ Dec 20th 2008 4:35PM
You forgot one
Reason 5) I can enjoy 9GB of Standard Def or 25GB of Hi-Def and am willing to sacrifice picture and audio quality to do so.
Reallynotnick @ Dec 20th 2008 8:55PM
WebDev511, no movie needs over 25GB, they just have to drop the Mpeg-2 crap (which already seems to be the case) and cut out all the extra shit they put on the disc and either move it to a second disc, a special edition, or have it be accessible with 2.0 online.
Personally I wish it would just start the movie right away if I put the disc in to a BD player or DVD player, I would be in heaven.
WebDev511 @ Dec 21st 2008 12:00PM
@Reallynotnick
While I do not disagree that MPEG-2 shouldn't be used, it's not the only thing taking up space.
You should click over to bluraystatistics.com and look at the brakedown of BD25/BD50 per studio, then drill into the codecs being used.
If studios want to do a hybrid disc with 9GB SD & 25GB HD-Lite (lower bit-rate video & lossy sountracks) they had better make sure they're also doing a BD50 with high bit-rate video and lossless audio. They sell the hybrid for between $20-25 and the Full HD for $30-35 or it wouldn't work.
Gus @ Dec 22nd 2008 12:04AM
Michael, interesting, I see you have stolen a companion box from "Portal"!
How'd you get it past the scanner without it vaporising??
burndive @ Dec 22nd 2008 1:33PM
Backwards compatibility? I don't want DVD content taking up room on my Blu-ray! This is good for forward compatibility, though. You release a Blu-ray only disc with all the trimmings, and then you release a "Blu-ray enhanced" DVD with just the movie and minimal extras for all those chumps out there who haven't bought a player yet, but are planning to, some day.
nikita @ Dec 23rd 2008 10:17AM
Everyones missing the point. How many years have they been working on this? If they really wanted to make an impression and really forward the techology, they should have spent their time figuring out a way to make existing Blu-ray players play all the HD-DVDs that were made and bought by those who went that way.
This way I would have been impressed. And before everyone starts to tell me its impossible, I already know it. But it would have been a feat non the less
Roberta @ Dec 23rd 2008 5:44PM
I think that this a great idea. Once Blu-Ray dies (and it will when real 4k hi-def comes out in a few years), we'll be able to play the SD layer on 4k players. There's no way that the 4k players will pay licensing fees to play discs that currently have less than 10% of the marketplace.
If HD DVD had used hybrid discs for all of their releases, it would be the only HD disc format around now. Sadly, that didn't happen.
Roberta
Roberta @ Dec 23rd 2008 5:49PM
I think that this a great idea. Once Blu-Ray dies (and it will when real 4k hi-def comes out in a few years), we'll be able to play the SD layer on 4k players. There's no way that the 4k players will pay licensing fees to play discs that currently have less than 10% of the marketplace.
If HD DVD had used hybrid discs for all of their releases, it would be the only HD disc format around now. Sadly, that didn't happen.
Roberta